Jefferson County Health Emergency Room Director
Whooping cough epidemic stopped through the Church in Jefferson County.
Churches in Jefferson County WA used our strategy to mobilize prayer and establish councils to connect in 7 spheres of society. On Mar 27 they met and a County Commissioner asked them to pray about the whooping cough epidemic. Last night I was with them when the director of emergency services addressed this Council. As of April 13 there has not been one case reported. From epidemic proportions to zero.
The PTLeader reported on 4/10/12 that the whooping cough had become an epidemic all though there were only two cases reported in the last two weeks (note the time the Church began to pray above). The headline in the PTLeader on 5/15/2012 states "No New Cases Here Since April 13.."
In December the police chief asked them to pray about crime and it decreased by more than 50% compared to the Christmas holidays last year. Click here for Ap. Jake's testimony.
Are you looking to your faith in action to transform your community with real results? This testimony is the power of a united Church working together. Discover the strategy and principles this powerful series on "Strategic Leadership." Click here.
5/27/2012 04:07:16 pm
This is fascinating. Are you claiming that this is evidence that prayer works? I'm sure you must have anticipated the skeptics' questions: why is this not simply the results of whooping cough vaccine, luck, or other natural explanations?
5/28/2012 02:34:07 am
Yes, that is exactly what I am saying and it is based on my experience. Since 2005 I've done my best to apply a scientific method where in you change one variable to test results against a hypothesis. While I cannot do this in a controlled environment I've enough experience I believe to prove the case. This is just one of many cases. Here is a page with a few of the testimonies (results) we've been tracking for the last 7 years. http://www.ortprayer.org/results.html. The same minister responsible for the testimony above directed the Churches prayer on crime (request by police chief) and he saw remarkable results. He is one of 13 cities we've recorded decreased crime in. This article illustrates well how the one element changed and the results changed. http://www.ortprayer.org/feb-2012-testimonies.html. You will find 30 documented signs, wonders, miracles recorded in my book Operation Rolling Thunder the Revised Edition. It takes us up through 2010. Since then the number has more than doubled. This does not include all of the personal healing testimonies (ie. lung cancer healed) nor how lives, laws, nor situations were changed. These testimonies are merely a sampling. Not to mention all of my own personal testimonies where in Jesus Christ intervened upon my behalf in very personal and supernatural ways.
5/28/2012 03:09:16 am
Simply praying for X and then X happening is not sufficient evidence to argue that prayer was the actual cause of X. The plausible natural explanation always trumps the supernatural explanation, wouldn't you agree?
5/28/2012 03:16:51 am
Just to clarify, I'd be delighted to find strong evidence that prayer works, but in this case there are natural explanations that haven't been ruled out. If this case can be strengthened, I'd like to blog about it.
5/28/2012 03:40:54 am
Bob do you have a personal relationship with Jesus? Have you met him? Do you consider yourself a Christian or nor? (sincerely asking just so I can understand more of where you are coming from)
5/28/2012 03:53:44 am
I am not a Christian.
5/28/2012 04:24:56 am
Thanks for clarifying that is very helpful to me in understanding where you are coming from. You are correct in that you don't have to be a Christian to examine a claim. In fact, I commend you.
5/28/2012 04:38:55 am
5/28/2012 04:56:26 am
“I do not have a complete environment I can control.”
6/8/2012 03:31:10 pm
Bob, here is something to be skeptical about, I prayed for this deaf woman, deaf for 20 years, and after the demon of deafness was cast out she could hear! What about that?
6/8/2012 03:38:17 pm
6/8/2012 10:18:38 pm
I had no idea that deafness involved a demon. Hearing problems run in my family and the majority of them are Xians. Not once did they seek a healing service for the congenital nerve deafness that runs in our family. Because of that, I am a bit offended you consider hearing impairments a form of demon possession. There is nothing wrong with a person who does not hear nor do they have demons, which even my relatives would vouch the same. IMHO, I would say there is something wrong with hearing people who believe one has a demon if they have a hearing impairment. I feel sorry for the poor woman you put through hell, making her think she had a demon. There was absolutely nothing wrong with her. She wasn't the one who had the problem and my Xian relatives would agree. In some ways, hearing loss is a gift. I seriously doubt you cast out any "demons of deafness", because there is no such thing. Deafness of any form is normal, despite what ignorant hearing people may think. Even as we age, humans loose some or all of their hearing. It's rare when one does not. Cochlear implants help some people hear better, but it does not remove the fact they are deaf. Remove the implant and they are still deaf, but that does not mean there is something wrong with them.
6/8/2012 10:29:30 pm
Oh please! I just watched the video and that was purely show. She didn't hear a thing, just acted on cue as she was told to do. Yes, I know what she signed, because I can read sign language, but it was purely an act. She still cannot hear, because of the damage meningitis caused to between her brain and her cochlea. If you really believe she can now hear, you're really being fooled. Sorry, man, but she's still deaf and you're still abusing her with your religious beliefs (as well as the person in the video). It's probably a good thing she acted on cue to make you think she was "cured", because all you'd do is continue the religious abuse. The best thing for her is that she gets away from such religious abuse. What is being done here is pure religious and spiritual abuse, which should be loathed by everyone, because it does great harm psychologically. If anyone is the demon, it's the person abusing her religiously and spiritually.
6/9/2012 03:26:57 am
Thanks Neil, I've seen God do similar things. But to address our atheist and humanist friends..... The scripture are below and what they observed in the video would be similar to the kind of prayer that the $250,000 study I referred Bob to that he refused to consider. Medical doctors did a study following Heidi Bakers' ministry in Africa and measured "statistical improvement" in both blindness and deafness.
6/9/2012 03:55:18 pm
“he refused to consider”
5/28/2012 06:07:11 am
There is both natural healing and supernatural. God designed our bodies to heal itself as long as it is provided the proper nutrients. The supernatural occurs when it goes beyond the normal course of events.
5/28/2012 06:55:58 am
“There is both natural healing and supernatural.”
5/28/2012 11:14:25 am
Scientific proof is great in many areas of life, but there are somethings in life that proof becomes a matter of truth in the life of a person.
5/28/2012 11:30:26 am
Your story about the boy is all natural. We needn’t imagine anything supernatural to explain it.
5/28/2012 01:23:04 pm
In reply to "“There is both natural healing and supernatural.”
5/28/2012 01:36:42 pm
“it is impossible for you to convince me otherwise”
5/28/2012 02:34:34 pm
Personally, I see it as evidence that vaccinations work and prayer had nothing to do with it. You'd get the same results if everyone, with few exceptions, were vaccinated and no one prayed about it. That's the scientific medical truth. No demons involved, just like there were no demons involved with the Plague either.
5/29/2012 12:22:56 am
I'm not saying Doctors, vaccines, medicine etc. is not good. It is and we are thankful. But man has limits where as God does the miraculous. I asked a South African (68 year old) whom I prayed for three weeks ago in Europe for a testimony last night. I'm pasting it below. Until last night, I was not even aware that he had consulted his chiropractor. Then I'm going to paste a few links to other healings that involve consulting doctors as well. One of these is an unfolding story posted on CNN.
5/29/2012 12:34:21 am
CNN Story - May 29, 2012 published by Senior Medical Correspondent - http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/29/health/faith-copelands-bacteria/index.html
5/29/2012 12:40:43 am
I forgot to highlight from the CNN article what Dad said the doctors said....."The words I hear from the medical professionals to describe Aimee's continued recovery are 'astonishing, incredible, confounding, mind boggling, and unbelievable,' " Copeland wrote on Aimee's Facebook page on May 12. "My favorite word is miracle." http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/29/health/faith-copelands-bacteria/index.html
5/29/2012 12:43:09 am
I'm not sure what the letter proves. I have a friend, about the same age, who was in a car accident recently, which put her in ICU for about a week. Few people knew about it that first week, but the drs manage to fix her collapsed lung shortly after she arrived in the ER. Nobody knew where she was or that she had the accident at that time, so there were no prayers at that moment, but her life was saved by the doctors (thank you, wonderful doctors) and she only spent a week in ICU at most with a broken rib and other broken bones, before going to a regular room and then another week there, before going to rehab. Now, of course, she is a Xian and therefore was more than likely praying herself, but even if she was unable to do so at the time, the doctors saved her life and should be given credit.
5/29/2012 03:29:38 am
Yes, I was aware of the girl with the bacterial infection. I’ll grant you that living is a lot better than the alternative, but this story is a sign of God’s love? That this girl is now in critical condition, that it’s put her family through hell, and (assuming she comes out of this alive) she’ll be missing a leg, her other foot, and both hands??
5/29/2012 12:31:52 pm
Bob, it is interesting to me how you pick and choose which pieces of stories to choose to focus on.
5/29/2012 05:16:23 pm
5/31/2012 12:35:20 am
5/31/2012 02:41:18 am
No, I do not believe you have accurately portrayed my position neither have you accurately portrayed what was presented in a number of areas some of which for time I won't address. The anecdotal testimonies were supplemented with articles and research that include statistics and doctors opinions etc. to which you never allude and dismiss without acknowledgement.
5/31/2012 05:36:27 pm
“No, I do not believe you have accurately portrayed my position”
6/2/2012 05:20:15 am
Thanks! I appreciate your efforts to exercise some sort of journalistic standard of ethics.
6/1/2012 03:08:06 am
5/31/2012 07:02:03 am
What is remarkable about all of this is, Bob & Mriana do not know it, but they are actually an answer to prayer on my behalf. Just last week I began praying for souls and others to share Jesus with. If you'll look back through all my articles there is not hardly one reply. The few that did reply were Christians. This is a first and I'm thankful that they are an answer to prayer. Thank you Jesus.
5/31/2012 11:22:16 am
Nah, you just gave me a good story to write, that's all. Bob just pointed out the story and I turned it into a news article. To be fair, I write for a Top Google news source: http://www.goddiscussion.com/97148/whooping-cough-halted-in-jefferson-county-washington-kingdom-league-international-taking-credit-for-halting-the-epidemic%C2%9D-with-prayer/
5/31/2012 05:58:42 pm
5/31/2012 05:47:20 pm
5/31/2012 10:16:58 pm
Yes, it is cool that we both got articles out of this and yes, I did write a book, but I noticed upon publishing there were still typos on it. :( Oh well. I guess I can always fix it.
6/1/2012 03:10:58 am
Maddening. I know how that feels. But keep in mind that you can always upload a new version.
6/1/2012 03:35:57 am
Yes, it is neat and when I get the time, I am going to upload a new version to get rid of those typos.
6/2/2012 12:53:50 pm
“I appreciate your efforts to exercise some sort of journalistic standard of ethics.”
6/9/2012 11:02:09 pm
Bob, I'd be less concerned about their superstition and more concerned about their agenda. They are part of the 7 Mountains, meaning they are part of the group that wants to make our government a Theocracy, teach pseudo-science and false history to our grandchildren, force women to become baby factories, destroy our habitat called earth, pump out propaganda on our TVs, computers, and radios, put 1/2 Pisces on Walmart alien ships, and brainwash our families, so that they die like other animals in the wild, instead of receiving good quality scientific health care, as their pastors rape our grandchildren mentally and physically also with their mega Walmart sized churches. That's their "7 Spheres" agenda in a nutshell and they will do it with another Inquisition, if they have to, so I'd wouldn't bother with their superstition, but use your site to get the word out about their agenda.
6/10/2012 01:05:55 pm
3/4's of all people who contracted whooping cough............ were vaccinated. Good research, entertaining and eye opening..... THANK GOD we prayed! Thanks Neil! http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PXX9rOqtqsw
6/10/2012 01:17:03 pm
Really? I question that statement, because my mother, a Xian, vaccinated me for everything possible during the 60s and 70s. I never caught Mumps, Whooping Cough, etc. I did the same for my sons and they never caught any of the childhood illnesses, not even Whooping Cough. You're statement is not valid scientifically or even experience wise. The only sure way to prevent such illnesses is to vaccinate, not pray, but vaccinate. To do otherwise and not vaccinate, is not showing that you care and love your child, despite you saying that "God is love". To reject science is to go back to a day before we discovered what caused the Plague and do nothing about it. The truth is, there was a scientific reason and answer people caught and died of the Plague, just as there is for Whooping Cough. Science is what stopped the Plague and science stopped Whooping Cough.
6/11/2012 03:23:47 pm
The article referenced says this: “Seventy-four percent of confirmed cases in the county are people that were vaccinated against whooping cough.” (Source: http://www.northkitsapherald.com/news/153828135.html)
6/11/2012 10:21:56 pm
This is true, vaccinations do not provide lifelong immunity. Medical professionals use to think that, but that thinking changed, and along with it the schedule for immunizations. Not even one single smallpox vaccination is considered lifelong immunity anymore, because viruses and bacteria evolve quickly and are some of the fastest living evolving species. Thus, one of the many reasons why one is vaccinated for one flu, one years and 10 years later, need vaccinated against the a similar strand of flu. Thus, there is scientific reasons to re-vaccinate every so many years as well as update our information and medical procedures. Prayer doesn't do anything to fight against illness. If that were true, then the Plague would have ended much sooner without science.
6/12/2012 02:33:39 am
6/10/2012 01:24:26 pm
Obviously you've not took the time to review the data. The vaccines introduced the epidemic
6/10/2012 02:09:24 pm
The pseudo-science data? That means as much to me as a bat being a bird, found in the Bible, means to me.
6/11/2012 03:33:30 pm
Seriously?? You might well be alive today because of vaccines.
6/11/2012 10:27:16 pm
It is hard to imagine such ignorance in the 21st century, esp with the abundance of information. Unfortunately, people have to be knowledgeable enough to know what is really science and what is pseudo-science. If they believe Creationism, then they probably don't know what is pseudo-science.
6/14/2012 01:23:17 am
I marvel at you two. Your characterization about my beliefs (ie. science, are not consistent with my statements even within this dialouge). You mock the last resource, call is psuedo science when it is clearly and simply investigative reporting where the man lists and shows his sources for his conclusions illustrating that for more than 7 decades, no whooping cough and then remarkably it begins, conincides with introduction of the vaccine in 2009. That is the context for his statement of 75% of the cases were previously vaccinated. You either did not bother to look at the source again, or you've ignored it, which speaks to your lack of journalistic or moral integrity for the truth.
6/14/2012 02:37:31 am
6/14/2012 03:28:55 am
Yes, Tim, I believe other apes are our cousins and that we shared a distant ancestor. I'm glad to be a monkey's aunt too. :) I wasn't mocking the article at all. I was just telling it like it is and not even telling hateful lies. I really feel sorry for you, to be honest.
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Founder and overseer of KLI, and the spiritual architect of 1Church1Day & Operation Rolling Thunder.